Masterpiece Cakeshop refuses to bake a wedding cake for gay couple

wedding cake thinkstock.jpg
Masterpiece Cakeshop will not bake this cake.
UPDATE: Masterpiece Cakeshop's days of shutting out same-sex couples appear to be over. In December 2013, an administrative law judge ordered Masterpiece's owner, Jack Phillips, to cease discriminating against gay couples. In May 2014, the Colorado Civil Rights Commission unanimously upheld his ruling. After the second hearing, however, Philips said he hadn't baked a wedding cake since early 2014: His shop has been too busy fulfilling orders from supporters.

Yesterday afternoon, 28-year-old Dave Mullins and 31-year-old Charlie Craig stopped by Lakewood's Masterpiece Cakeshop to order their wedding reception cake -- what they hoped would be a rainbow-layered masterpiece decked out in teal and red frosting (their ceremony colors). Although they'll be reciting their vows in Provincetown, Massachusetts, in September, the couple plans to celebrate with a reception for friends and family in Denver in October. But after bakery owner Jack Phillips listened to their request, they say, he refused it. His business doesn't create cakes for gay weddings.

See Also:
- Masterpiece Cakeshop refuses gay wedding: Readers share their stories

"It was the most awkward, surreal, very brief encounter," Mullins says. "We got up to leave, and to be totally honest, I said, 'Fuck you and your homophobic cake shop.' And I may or may not have flipped him off."

Mullins posted his reaction on Facebook, from where it branched to web sites such as Wipe Out Homophobia, creating a minor Internet frenzy. Since then, similar stories about the shop have surfaced, and Yelp reviewers have written more than sixty comments expressing disgust. There is now a Facebook-organized protest of the business underway and an online petition with signatures from several states and countries.

On the phone with Westword this morning, a Masterpiece staff member commented only, "We have nothing to say about that."

But are the accusations of discrimination true? "We don't want to talk about that, so you'll just have to make something up."

masterpiece cake 3.jpg
They will, however, make this one.
What's not made up have been other tales about Masterpiece, like this one:

"I feel I need to disclose to anyone with an 'alternative' lifestyle, that this company does not want your business, as they do not participate in making cakes for 'illegal' things, such as a commitment ceremony (exact quote)," Yelp user Samantha S. recounted. "All we wanted was a cake, and I totally respect the right to refuse service, (but) I feel obligated to help anyone else avoid what was an incredibly awkward situation by selecting this place for your services. That is simply it (right, wrong or indifferent). Nothing more, nothing less."

But Masterpiece did extend a different offer: "They did say over the phone later, that if someone like me wanted a birthday cake, or something unlike a wedding cake, that they would take our order."

Some online commentors have advocated violence against Masterpiece, but Mullins says he and Craig "do not condone shit-throwing, bombs or any kind of crazy violent actions." The two have dated for almost two years, and Mullins has identified as gay his entire life, during which he faced homophobia at school, on the streets and at clubs.

"But this is the first time I've ever been refused service at a business because I was gay," he says. "I want (Phillips) to know that what he did hurt us. All we wanted was a cake. We didn't want him to put on a rainbow shirt and march in the gay pride parade. This is me standing up for my community's rights."

Until yesterday, Masterpiece Cakeshop's ratings on Yelp included four five-star reviews, one four-star review and one low outlier -- three stars. As of this morning, with 71 reviews, the restaurant's average is 1.5 stars.

The couple has now "decided to go to the gayest cake shop we could think of. We went to Le Bakery Sensual and had a great experience," Mullins says. "They made us feel great, and no one batted an eye. When we told them what had happened, more than a few eyebrows went up."



Location Info

Masterpiece Cakeshop

3355 S. Wadsworth Blvd., Lakewood, CO

Category: Restaurant


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168 comments
buff9786
buff9786

You criticize the cake baker for doing wrong and have no guilt about lies told on YELP.  That's messed up.  I'd rather do business with someone who believes strongly about a faith than someone who doesn't have the common decency to not tell a lie.  Basic morals of any belief system.

junebug23
junebug23

First our nostalgic word gay has been taken 2nd our rainbow has been taken and now  homosexual people want to take anyone and everyone to court because they feel they are being discriminated..Not everyone agrees with  your lifestyle and not everyone need to bow before you because they have Christian beliefs.You are all familiar with this bakery from the past so why come all the way from Littleton to order a cake ?No bakery where you live?. This bakery will not be alone in its decision there are many of us who cheer on  this business for sticking up for their rights,..Want a cake?  go to King Soopers....

DrTomorrow
DrTomorrow

Good. Let the faggots go somewhere else!

winchesterjoe
winchesterjoe

Lets get one thing straight.  The term 'gay' is an adjective meaning happy unfettered jouous etc.  It had ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with the correct proper description  of the twisted lifestyles of Sodomites.  The correct decription is HOMSEXUAL PERVERT.  Gay may be used to properly describe happy people - but unless you are a pervert yourself or a moron or both - do NOT whitewash these Godless evil disease riddled social pariahs with that term that they themelsves created so as to make their filthy lifestyles acceptable to normal people.

 

Homosexual perversion is and had been against the laws of MAN and the laws of GOD and the laws of NATURE since the dawn of civilization. Pervers wicked nauseous conduct such as the putrid rancid conduct of these degenerates is unconscionable.  No one was ever 'born' a pervert. It is a learned evil influenced by but not limited to ones environment and early life experiences. These abominable creatures conduct themselves in that horrid fashion because they WANT TO! - PERIOD!

 

Look at the conduct of one of the filthy animals.  Was he civil to the wishes of the owner the laws of God and normal society?  NO - he felt compelled to be nasty filthy and aggresive with foul language and obscene gestures. I would have expected no less from his ilk.

 

As for some of the comments - they are very telling of the deptaved nature of Americans after generations of tolerence of evil as if it were some sort of RIGHT to be vile and putrid and filthy in public. These animals who insulted the Shop owner are the enemies of God as are ALL unrepentant wicked people. IF they were in fact decent and repentant people - they wouldn't be mocking and demeaning the sanctity of Holy Matrimony with ther perverse filth.

 

AND for some scumbag Christian hating  puke like the creature who calls her self 'The COUNTESS' to show her evil nature and her ignorance and her hatred for goodness and decency by her blasphemy of Christ was unconscionable.  She was the one who used two passages from the New Testamant to blaspheme Jesus in the cruelest of ways..

 

She alludes to two passeges - one from Matthew and one from Luke - but both referring to the  same incident.  The passages clearly state that A wealthy Roman had a an exceptionally good and loyal  servant  who had fallen ill and beseched the Lord to heal him whih He did.

For this hatemongering dirbag to present the incident as proof of theLord's approval of homosexul pervesions is unconscionable - evil wicked and blasphemous!  But suchis the TREU nature of Perverts and their  appologists.  Read it for yourself - so that you will see just how low the supporters of these  degenerate pedophile Sodomites can sink.

 

When I ws a very young man before most readers were even born - and this nation was STILL essentially good - the presence of perverse Christ mocking filth like her would not be tolerated for one moment.  Anger towards the enemies of God has never been anything but justified.   If there was NEVER any such thing as RIGHTEOUS anger - then  Jesus had committed a sin when he became so enraged at the swindlers inside the temple that he made a whip - beat the ofensive blasphemers and kicked over their tables.  That of course is not the case.  I was making a point. 

 

There were other putrid filthy comments by people who boasted of their Christian faith who fully condoned the conduct of these filthy animals whose agenda was to mock ridicule pervert and  trash the beauty of the sacramant of marriage between my mother and my father - my son and his wife orf myself and my wife  - into a meaningless secular convenience to gain benefits to legally conduct their filthy nasty unGodly unhealthy abominable conduct.

 

What the owner did was right moral courageous Godly and in the finest tradition of TRUE moral Americanism.  We used to call it defending the faith.  I risked my life LONG AGO as a Green Beret Paratroop commander when we had REAL enemies as a REAL threat to our nation - the Communists.  I will DAMN sure risk some adverse blasphemy from socital scum to defend what I hold dear and sacred today and HAVE held inviolate since I was old enough to know right from wrong!

 

Unrepentent homosexual perverts - Sodomites pedophiles etc will never ever bee accepted by  decent truly  righteous people of ANY culture of ANY ethnicity of ANY race ANYWHERE on earth - PERIOD.  There - now do we finally GET IT?

kimberlysaint
kimberlysaint

 @k.george80 Do show me where in the Bible it says that God hates gay people?  If I'm not mistaken (and I'm not), God loves ALL of his children.  Trust me, I have a hard time swallowing the fact that this must include you, but if we are going to speculate on how God feels, I imagine it makes him very said that you are being so hateful to his children.  Gay people are not trying to take over the world, only insecure ignorant people think that, they are merely trying to live in it with the same rights that ALL others are afforded.  I can't believe that in this day in age that this civil rights battle is still having to be fought, but know this, you and your hateful kind will lose.  All the hate in your heart is already destroying your life.  I will pray for you.  And as far as the bakery is concerned, it is ridiculous (and should be illegal as other forms of discrimination are) to not bake wedding cakes for gay people, but then to use their christianity to back it up is ludicrous.  My guess it that they gladly bake wedding cakes for atheists, Jewish people, and all other religions that completely disagree with their own beliefs.  So it isn't about standing up for their religion.  It is about discriminating against gay people.  End of story.  How our great land of the free has let this go on for so long I am not sure.  But I love our country, I have great faith in it and it will do the right thing, hopefully sooner than later.

Not that it makes any difference to my point, but I am a straight woman, happily married to the love of my life.  And I wish that joy on ALL human beings, ALL of God's children.

zhongxin51039
zhongxin51039

R. I. does not recognize same-sex marriage. So Masterpiece Cakeshop can legally refuse to service a same-sex marriage.

Reader
Reader

I am just another straight, christian, parent, taxpayer, former boyscout, athelete, who doesn't remember where in the Bible Christ proclaimed that it is our place to sit in judgement of each other. As I recall it is pretty clear that someone else has that job sewn up - and it is not you or I. Hate is hate and it doesn't have anything to do with gods will for us.

I would just suggest that the owner of this bakery read the comments listed here and then take a look inside and see if this is the kind of person he is and more importantly if the real christians that he has known in his life would ever speak this way. If the people commenting here are your customers then you can count on me avoiding your establishment I wouldn't want to expose my family to such blatant hatred. 

namename
namename

They should try to get a wedding cake from a Muslim Bakery that practices Shirea Law. The men will then be stoned to death...Still going to hate-on Christian consience?

myself
myself

SHUT YOUR eating hole!! I hate when gays and lesbians get all offended because someone does not agree with their way of life, always wanting more "rights", more from everyone and everything... but when other "groups" suffer discrimination (the real kind of discrimination) no one cares and gays do not support them, but if it is against them (gays and lesbians) they scream wanting support from everyone!!

 

this business has the right to serve to who ever they feel like, maybe next time they will refuse service to whites, or mexicans, or arabs.. who knows!!!!

lfamily
lfamily

This business has the right to run their business according the values and principles they hold dear to.  I am sick and tired of homosexual bullying, intimidation, scare tactics....all intended to force those of us who do not support the homosexual lifestyle/behavior like these people want us to.  Tolerance? They don't walk the talk.  Read David Kupelian's book The Marketing of Evil.  The first chapter is all about this and how we MUST speak up against it.  I will drive from southern Coloado just to support this bakery just like we are driving to the nearest ChickFilA on August 1. 

carrienoel
carrienoel

Carrienoel I live on the south end of Coorado Springs and I WOULD DRIVE ALL THE WAY TO DENVER to buy my baked goods from him, too. Maybe I could carpool with American!! We are TIRED of having gay "wrongs" trying to explain why they aren't WIERD. Go to the "gay bakeries". The owners have their RIGHTS, too!!

Alcie
Alcie

Here's a thought, I am sure there are bakeries like Devil's Food, that are owned and operated by gays (at least this was the case at one time), do business with people who appreciate whatever agenda you have, either way. Why are people stepping all over each others' toes, when this is unnecessary. The is enough commotion in the world, focus on what is significant. Everything in life does not have to have to become a political brouhaha.

muneshadowe
muneshadowe

Here we go with the propaganda again.

"Congress SHALL make no law with the establishment of a religion or the free exercise there of"

They have a right to REFUSE SERVICE on religious grounds period. Just because the pervs want to indoctrinate the rest of our society on their life style does not mean we have to obey it.

muneshadowe
muneshadowe

 @pauliji I hate to tell you this but they have this little thing called a right that our illustrious esteemed leaders fail to recognize to not give service. In addition I believe this is a test case these two individuals are attempting to try out to destroy this company with. Remember "Congress SHALL make no law with the establishment of a religion or the free exercise there of"? People seem to forget that the Constitution goes both ways.

steve.harvey.hd28
steve.harvey.hd28

Though Masterpiece Cakeshop does not have the right to discriminate against potential clients on the basis of sexual orientation (see Colorado SB08-200), potential clients do have the right to discriminate against Masterpiece Cakeshop. I recommend that anyone who is not homophobic seek a less offensive baker for all occasions. Let's make sure that bigotry is bad for business.

k.george80
k.george80

" Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: Who changed the TRUTH of God into a LIE, and worshipped and served the creature more than the creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

 For this cause God gave them up unto VILE affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is AGAINST NATURE:  And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their LUST one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly , and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a REPROBATE mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

 

Being filled with all UNRIGHTEOUSNESS, FORNICATION, WICKEDNESS, COVETOUSNESS, MALICIOUSNESS; FULL OF ENVY, MURDER, DEBATE, DECEIT, MALIGNITY WHISPERERS, BACKBITERS, HATERS OF GOD,DESPITEFUL, PROUD, BOASTERS, INVENTORS OF EVIL THINGS, DISOBEDIENT TO PARENTS,  WITHOUT UNDERSTANDING, COVENANTBREAKERS, WITHOUT NATURAL AFFECTION, IMPLACABLE, UNMERCIFUL:

 

Who knowing the JUDGEMENT OF GOD, that they which commit such things are  WORTHY OF DEATH, NOT ONLY DO THE SAME, BUT HAVE PLEASURE IN THEM THAT DO THEM."

 

This is a quote from Romans 1: 24-32 and it makes it VERY clear, homosexuals can scream ALL they want to about they were born that way( LIE) they don't believe the Bible, they have rights, we want this and we want that, but in the end they will burn in the Lake of Fire with all the other trash of humanity.  You all who read this can scoff and hate me ALL you want but when the heart of yours STOPS BEATING , you will REMEMBER this post and how someone took their time to WARN you that you would end up where you are and you have absolutely not one person to blame but yourselves. Remember you can't PROVE there is NO HELL, just like I can't PROVE there is physically, so you SODOMITES are taking a 50/50 chance with your ETERNITY if the Bible is CORRECT!!!

kimberlysaint
kimberlysaint

 @winchesterjoe You really crack me up.  I do FINALLY get it.  Pedophiles will never ever be accepted by righteous people ever.  YEA!!  That is such good news.  Finally something hate mongers and gay people can agree on, pedophilia is bad.  Good thing being gay has nothing to do with being a pedophile.  Might I suggest a dictionary to help with your basic vocabulary struggles?  You are mean and nasty yet you make me giggle.  

 

Here is my favorite line from your silly rant:

When I ws a very young man before most readers were even born - and this nation was STILL essentially good - the presence of perverse Christ mocking filth like her would not be tolerated for one moment.  Anger towards the enemies of God has never been anything but justified.   If there was NEVER any such thing as RIGHTEOUS anger - then  Jesus had committed a sin when he became so enraged at the swindlers inside the temple that he made a whip - beat the ofensive blasphemers and kicked over their tables.  That of course is not the case.  I was making a point.

 

Does that make anyone else laugh?  It's the part at the end that gets me......that of course is not the case.  I was making a point.

What point was that? That you are a ridiculous, unreasonable, human being?

Point made, point made.

Bigheart
Bigheart

As far as everyone having the status of being the children of GOD we quote Jesus speaking in John 8:44 "You are actually of the father - the devil and all the desires of your father you will do. He is who from the beginning was a man-slayer. And in the Truith does not stand because there is no Truth in him; whenever he speaks he speaks a lie of his own because  he is of falsehood also it father."

 

This is why we humans who all fall short of the Glory of GOD must be born-again...

 

Romans1:21 Because of having known GOD  they did not glorify Him as The GOD and thank Him but, they became destitute in their reasoning and became dull and their hearts were without acknowledgement. 22) And when they thought in themselves that they were wise they became insane.23) And they changed the Glory of GOD Who is not corrupted into the likeness of and the image of a corruptible man, and into the likeness of birds and four footed animals and of creeping things of the earth. 24)  Because of this GOD handed them over to the vile desires of their heart that they would digrace their bodies among themselves. 25) And they exchanged the Truth of GOD for lies and they revered and they served created things more than their Creator to Whom belongs praises and blessings to the eternity of eternities, Amen.

 

Coloradolover
Coloradolover

 @Reader It seems as though the owner of this bakery responded in a straight-forward manner to this request.  Did he flip off or curse out the people requesting the "wedding" cake in question?  That might have indicated some anger or hate.  He just responded that he couldn't make this "wedding" cake because it went against his beliefs.  His business, his beliefs.  Sounds reasonable to me.  For the moment it's still a free country.

 

 

kimberlysaint
kimberlysaint

 @namename Huh?  Are we still talking about America?  Are you honestly trying to say that their beliefs aren't that hateful compared to murderers?  Wow, what church do you go to, don't want to stumble in that hate filled place on accident one Sunday morning while trying to rejoice in my loving God.

kimberlysaint
kimberlysaint

 @myself Ummm, it is illegal to discriminate based on nationality or race.  That's pretty much the point.  Gay people want the same or equal (in case you aren't familiar with the definition) rights.  Thanks for bringing that up.  If you need more information read this:

I am very disapointed that the Masterpiece Cake Shop is allowed to legally discriminate.  People keep mouthing off about freedom of speech and first amendment rights (which I wholeheartedly support) but what about civil rights for all Americans?  This cake shop would not be allowed to legally discriminate against any other type of person but for some reason our great nation (and I do believe that the United States of American is a very great nation) has not stepped forward to make discrimination against gay people illegal and to afford all gay people the same basic civil rights as all other groups, including the right to marriage.  This civll rights battle will be won, but in the meantime the battle must be fought.  Gay people do not want special rights, they aren't trying to take over the world as commenter kGeorge 80 believes (you have to admit, as hurtful as he is trying to be, he is so ignorant its laughable); they just want to live in the world peacefully with equal rights.  For the Masterpiece Cake Shop to say that they can't bake wedding cakes for gay people because it goes against their Christian beliefs I would like to ask them, "Do you bake wedding cakes for atheists? Jewish people? Muslims? Buddhists? Adulterers?"  Of course they do, so to say that they don't bake wedding cakes for individuals who go against their Christian beliefs is preposterous.  It is merely a cover up for the truth; they don't bake wedding cakes for gay people because they don't like gay people so they are choosing to discriminate.  So how is this different than the Civil Rights movement in the 50s when black people and black supporters stood up to say that it is not okay to discriminate against race?  It isn't different.  As far as the people who continually refer to gay marriage as a "lifestyle" they are misinformed.  Being who you are and loving your soul mate is not a "lifestyle" it is a life.  For the hateful people who try to erroneously quote the Bible to tell others that God hates Gay people, first of all, the Bible does not say God hates gay people anywhere.  And secondly, the Bible most emphatically does say that God loves all of his children and we should love each other.  So how does all this hate towards God's children align with your Christian beliefs?  There are plenty of Gay Christians just as there are plenty of straight non-Christians.  Why pick on gay people then?  Why aren't you shaking your fist of damnation at non-believers?  I will tell you the answer because it is likely you do not even know.  It is because your rants and beliefs are motivated by ignorance and hate, not by God or Christianity.  For all of those people filled with hate and prejudice, I will quietly pray for you, that you will find peace in your heart. You purport to know or imagine how God feels, if I had to imagine I would say that he feels very sad by all the pain you are causing his children.  I pray that you will use your passion for good instead of wasting it away on hate and evil.

Not that this matters one iota; but I am a straight, married, Republican who loves her country and supports our military.  I would like to see other fair minded republicans come forward and to continue to make this country the land of the free and the home of the brave.  And to all of my gay friend and gay supporters; you are brave to stand up to this ignorance, you are brave to keep fighting.  Keep it up, as victory will be much sweeter than any cake from Masterpiece Cake Shop.

 

Wesson
Wesson

 @myself Actually, the business has no such right.  Such discrimination is illegal.  "Signed in May 2008, amendments to the Colorado Anti-Discrimination Act (Senate Bill 200) prohibits discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation or transgender status in several areas, including two key areas: housing and public accommodations."  The cake shop falls under the definition of public accommodations.  http://www.one-colorado.org/your-rights/

The_Countess
The_Countess

 @lfamily  "This business has the right to run their business according the values and principles they hold dear to."

 

and we have every right to tell others about it and to not do business with them because of it.

 

freedom of speech doesn't guarantee you protection from criticism of that speech. in fact that very criticism is also protected under free speech.

and not wanting your business dollars to be potentially be used for anti-gay propaganda or support for things like the yes-to-prop8 campaign is a legitimate reason not to want to do business with someone. (and this is a very real possibility, particularly with chick-fill-a.)

jameswptv
jameswptv

 @lfamily This business has the right to run their business according the values and principles they hold dear to.  I am sick and tired of African Americas bullying, intimidation, scare tactics....all intended to force those of us who do not support the equal rights or "Black" lifestyle/behavior like these people want us to.  Tolerance? They don't walk the talk.  Read "The White Power books .  The first chapter is all about this and how we MUST speak up against it.  I will drive from southern Coloado just to support this KKK just like we are driving to the nearest burning cross on August 1. .... See how stupid you sound when you replace the gay with black.... 

pauliji
pauliji

 @muneshadowe And you seem to be forgetting that Colorado has anti-discrimination laws that prevent this bakery from refusing service to anyone based on their actual or perceived sexual orientation. If they did that, then they broke the law, and have left themselves open to a lawsuit. If you are trying to say that anti-discrimination laws are unconstitutional, then you have a very difficult job to explain how. Especially if you're going to invoke the first amendment. Selling a cake is not in any way a religious expression. These bigots can worship any way they want. They can believe whatever they want. But engaging in a for profit business isn't a religious act. It's not protected by the first amendment. 

The_Countess
The_Countess

 @muneshadowe and we have every right to criticise them for it publicly AND not to do business with them.

 

you seem to forgot those rights go both ways.

Yvonne
Yvonne

@k.george80 And by the way - These are the words of Paul from the New Testement - a man with opinions about the Roman, who I think at the time were persecuting the Christian, and not the words of God or Jesus. Nor are his comments directed only to homosexuality. Rather they are directed to all immoral behaviors and how they can take the place of the love of God.

Yvonne
Yvonne

@k.george80 With all this hate you are spewing, you are 100% ensured of going to the hell you so fervently believe in. With that said, I do think the owner has the right to refuse service in this instance from a legal standpoint per the current laws. Just as the rest of us have a right to take our business else where.

truthseeker1797
truthseeker1797

 @k.george80

 People like you are unbelievable. You sit behind your book and your scriptures disecting every word and every verse trying to put definition into it and meanwhile you've lost all concept of the overall message of the love God gives us. You spend so much time focusing on the fire and brimstone of scripture you lose all grip with the rest of The Word. Thinking like this is what lead to the crusades you ignorant neanderthal.

kimberlysaint
kimberlysaint

@Bigheart And what exactly is your point Bigheart (very ironic name BTW)?  Like I said, we are all God's children. How does taking a few random Bible versus out of context to try to support your illogical thinking change anything? Let's try this one more time for you.  I do not believe being gay to be a sin.  But you obviously do.  So let's don't argue that issue.  For the sake of this argument let's just say you are right.   If I am not mistaken, aren't we all sinners?  Because Romans 3:23 does not say,

For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God (except for Bigheart, he's perfect.)

And why do you make the erroneous assumption that gay people don't also believe in God?  Is it because he called you up on the phone this afternoon and told you? Or is it because you believe they are sinners?   And what? Sinners can't believe in God?  Well, we just went over that didn't we.  So take your time, read it over again.  Maybe you will get it, maybe not.  But basically your argument makes no sense whatsoever, because we are all sinners.  So again I ask, why single out one group to hate and judge?  Pretty positive judgement doesn't rest with you or your kind.  Let's refresh your memory; Luke 6:37 "Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.  So, for people like you, who interrupt the Bible to your own hateful beliefs, how do you interrupt the two Bible versus above?

kimberlysaint
kimberlysaint

just to be clear, my above comment was directed at the original hateful poster, Ifamily.

muneshadowe
muneshadowe

 @pauliji Yada yada yada Why do you bigots forget it goes both ways not just your way? Oh that's right, it is only your way.

kimberlysaint
kimberlysaint

 @The_Countess Just wanted you to know that you are not the only reasonable person commenting.  I appreciated finding your comments amongst all the mind blowing nonsense.  I got in on it a bit late, but frankly it is becoming my new pastime to to try to force reason from one of these hate mongers.  So far I have been unsuccessful, lol.

k.george80
k.george80

 @Yvonne

You said what I thought you would say. The Bible is nothing but a letter of opinions by Paul, not the word of God, and God is not a God of justice just love all the time and no chastisment!!

k.george80
k.george80

 @Yvonne

 Romans 1:24-32 says Homosexuals are no different than that list of things mentioned for your information. Hey, I challenge you to go and get a REAL ancient Greek dictionary ( like I did) and see if you can still believe that nonesense.  You guys all think that everyone hates you and we Christians are mean and hateful. That is ALL you know !! Don't you understand that behind Christianity and other Religions is the written word. Quoting that word to others is no more "hate" as you and millions of other gays say, than quoting to someone what the book "1984" says.  God is love, yes, but he is also a God of wrath and has to punish sin. Sexual sin is one of the worst sins because it leads to a reprobate mind in which the person has sealed their fate.  Sure many in history were gay, but then came the Holy Bible and before that Jesus( whom I am sure you either hate or don't belive in) and although he came in love, he also came to divide as well. That too is in the Bible.  Did you know the Antichrist is going to be gay?? Yes, it's true. Here it is:

 

Daniel 11:37   " Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any God; for he shall magnify himself above all.   

 

That tells me plenty. That tells me a lot because the future demonic dictator will be a homosexual. How does that feel to know that the future dictator and Christ hater will be gay??  By the way, It says that same thing in Hebrew and this was NOT taken out of context. This is also the Old Testement which (real) JEWS believe in!!!

k.george80
k.george80

 @Yvonne

 Hate? What hate is that? I would really like to know. I am JUST telling you and the world what the SCRIPTURES say! Twisting it won't change the fact that homosexuality is a SIN. PERIOD!!! You weren't born that way you chose that way!!  You have NO idea what you are talking about as far as the ancient scriptures are concerned. What so you're an authority on what is really says!!  I have had ENOUGH of you queers!! Go to hell, I could care less. Don't shove your lifestyle on me or my family. I won't let you do it. By the way as long as I have breath I will fight you sodomites every step of the way and will never EVER give up!!!!

k.george80
k.george80

 @truthseeker1797  I don't put ANYTHING into the Bible; that is also against the word as well. Hey, this works both ways!! There IS such a thing as HATE against Christians you know?? I don't care WHAT you filthy degenerates do, just DON'T PUSH IT ON ME !

k.george80
k.george80

 @truthseeker1797YOU are the IGNORANT ONE you arrogant jerk!!! You know NOTHING about the Crusades. Where did you get your education at a auction?? Not only are you a sodomite but you're ignorant as well.

 

k.george80
k.george80

 @truthseeker1797

 People like me?? You mean REAL people?  The ones that aren't degenerate, filthy, immoral, misfits?  For one, I am not a Sodomite. I don't live and spread a lie like you all do.  You all are lost and there is no hope for you. You will spend enternity in the Lake of Fire because the Bible SAYS you will! Not ME, not Charlie Sheen, Not Kirk Cameron, BUT THE BIBLE YOU FOOL!  You gays can have your lifestyle. FINE. But know this some of us are not just going to sit around while you try to takeover I can promise you that!!! I for one am going to fight you tooth and nail! You are the ignorant one you useless FAGGOT!!!! How does it feel?? You start with the name calling and you get it right BACK FAG!! 

 

You queers make me SICK!! You are an abomination to God and he HATES YOUR GUTS!!  Read it for yourself!  You cannot change the BIBLE!!  You aslo can't twist it to suite your own needs. You know what?? Why don't all of you queers start your own COUNTRY? PERFECT!  What are you going to do for the population after people die off??  Oh, I forgot, You can't reproduce!!  Do you know why? because it wasn't meant for you to do so.  You call me an ignorant Neaderthal? Well, one thing I am not is a SODOMITE like your FAGGOT ASS. Go to hell, and never contact me again you faggot bastard.

kimberlysaint
kimberlysaint

 @Bigheart  @kimberlysaint i wish I had known from the beginning that you had been drinking.  Have you ever heard of the term reason?  I am finding that having a discourse with someone who possesses no reason is proving challenging. Your random nonsense is arbitrary and appears without point. How did you determine that gay people were not in good standing with God?  Because you think they are sinners?  And here we go again.......read my above posts over again.  Maybe when you sober up it will sink in?

Bigheart
Bigheart

@kimberlysaint What we who are in GOOD STANDINING with GOD have is that we now let the SPIRIT OF GOD predominately guide us instead of being led by the temptations of the flesh. We must be of the SPIRIT "kind" to be GOD'S kind. HEmust not just be GOD in our lives but, KING of our lives!

The_Countess
The_Countess

 @k.george80  hate, envy, pride, taking pleasure in the supposed future suffering of others, vanity.

 

I hate to say it but Douglas is right.

I'm pretty sure Jesus would say 'i know you not'.

Bigheart
Bigheart

@The_Countess @k.george80 That word is not for "gay" or "partner" but for child or boy. The New Testament was Originally written in the Aramaic language that has been derived from the Hebrew Language; not Greek as so many have been taught to believe...

The_Countess
The_Countess

 @k.george80 "Hate? What hate is that? I would really like to know. I am JUST telling you and the world what the SCRIPTURES say!"

 

hate is hate, whether its in scripture or not is irrelevant.

 

and on the other had that same scripture says in Matthew 8:5-13 and Luke 7:1-10 that Jesus helped a gay man by healing that man's partner.

(be sure to read the ancient 'originals' not the modern translation. btw, or just simply look up the different meanings of the word 'pais' that got translated as just 'boy' loosing much of its historical context )

 

so Jesus was able to set aside his misgivings (if he had any) and help that man, not hate him.

 

when will his Christians do the same?

 

or was Gandhi right? are your Christians so unlike your Jesus?

The_Countess
The_Countess

 @k.george80 "just DON'T PUSH IT ON ME !"

 

that's just it: NOBODY IS! all we are asking is you dont discriminate against them.

 

so why are you pushing your filthy degenerate barbaric moronic religious views on others!

 

The_Countess
The_Countess

 @TheBible  that's unfortunate. i was under the impression the new testament was a little kinder.

 

of course i should have expected this, it is a story about a man who was so mad at a fig tree for not having fruit for him out of season he condemned the tree to death.

 

that same guy however did help a gay man by healing that man's partner though. seems Jesus was able to set aside his misgivings and help them not hate them.

 

when will his Christians be able to do the same?

TheBible
TheBible

 @The_Countess

 

Sorry to burst your bubble, but it is in the new testament also.

Romans 1

24 Therefore God gave them over   in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. 25 They exchanged the truth about God for a lie,   and worshiped and served created things   rather than the Creator—who is forever praised.   Amen.

26 Because of this, God gave them over   to shameful lusts.   Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. 27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error.

The_Countess
The_Countess

 @k.george80 "I could care less what you all believe or what you all think."

 

so why are you even posting here?

 

and of course you dont care what i think. I didn't think you would. you are far to brainwashed for me to change you mind. if any logic comes along you can't refute you just ignore it, say its from the devil, and retreat into your tiny belief based shell.

 

so its a good thing my posts aren't for you. I'm not going to change your mind. you are insane and completely immune to rationality, sanity and logic.

I'm just here to shoot down your arguments for the benefits of others.

 

why you ask? i mean I'm not even gay, I'm white (for others he' s a racists: see post below) and born in a Christian country. i got nothing personally to gain by attacking you or your arguments.

 

its because i'm a good person and think the world would be a much better place without bigots like you walking around freely and unopposed. i do this so others can see the clear idiocy of your arguments and know to ignore you in the future.

 

"Just remember this post when you are burning in hell"

why exactly am i going to burn in hell? because i opposed hate? because i opposed racism? because as a kid i stole some candy?

a eternity in hell for something as small as stealing candy as a kid?

you have to admit, that's cruel.

 

in fact i have obeyed all the 10 commandments but the first 3-5(depending on your version) which only deal with believing in god and just god.

all god had to do to make me obey those was give me some proof that i can perceive with the 5 senses god himself gave me.

but he choose not to. so i was left with no other option but to not believe until proof is provided.

 

so i'm going to hell for all eternity for stealing candy as a kid and not believing in something i couldn't perceive.

 

again, that's really harsh wouldn't you agree?

but actually i think you like that. you like sentencing people to hell dont you? judging by the glee and vigor with which you do it here, you do! you think everybody who doesn't think like you deserves to go to hell. whatever you dont like, god must not like. your will and gods will are exactly the same in your mind. you probably think you're gods will reincarnate on this planet.

 

you know the last people to think that fly some planes into buildings and another started shooting people on a island. pretty sure none of those are in heaven right now.

The_Countess
The_Countess

 @k.george80 

"God gave us a FREE WILL!!

free will and a all knowing god can't co-exist without you accepting the logic of my arguments.

 

because god either isn't all knowing because of free will... which makes him fallible and therefore not much of a god.

or he is all knowing and gives us the illusion of free will but he knows beforehand what we are going to do with it in our lives if he lets us be born there instead of there. which pretty much negates the point of free will doesn't it

and that means he sets the majority of humans up to go to hell from the moment we are born.

 

and ignoring all that (and i know you will) how would free will save someone from hell who has never even heard of Christianity? through sheer logic that means god has sentenced billions of people to hell throughout history for no other crime then being born to far away from the middle east.

 

"Well tell me this, can you PROVE it's not there?"

of course i can't disprove god. no more then i can disprove a thee pot in orbit around Neptune at this very moment. you can never disprove a negative.

the fact is i cant disprove your god any more then you can disprove any of the other thousands of gods you dont believe in.

can you disprove reincarnation? can you disprove islam, judeism? Hinduism? Japanese ancestor worship? maybe Zeus or Ra? surely those 2, they haven't been worshipped in centuries! no?

 

so the chances of picking the right one are getting farther and farther removed from 50/50. a 1 in a thousand is putting it optimistically i think. is god really that cruel he would sentence the majority of humanity to hell just for picking the wrong one? and when the evidence based difference between all of them is nothing because none of them have any evidence what so ever... its a completley arbitrary choice. its like flipping a coin with a thousend sides and only one of them doesn't land you in hell.

 

"You Sodomites are gaining power and control simply because Satan, whom you follow, is going crazy and he knows his time is almost over; that's way all of this is happening with the Negro president, Gay rights, liberal laws, and of course the Nazi government in the U.S."

 

o wow... i think you just lost any shred of rationality you might have had left. bigot and a racists. why am I not surprised. (question: did god make black people just so you ' the chosen people' could rip on them and treat them like second class citizens or did the devil make them black and are they be definition evil from birth?)

 

so not sure what you are trying to accomplish here, but if its to prove religion is bad for you, you succeeded. with flying colors.

k.george80
k.george80

 @The_Countess

 You are one screwed up individual. You actually believe all that nonsense. For your information God gave us a FREE WILL!! Just like it was that same free will of that Illuminati brainwashed James Holmes to do what he did. God exists Sodomite and when you die, you will see that I was right.  You Sodomites are gaining power and control simply because Satan, whom you follow, is going crazy and he knows his time is almost over; that's way all of this is happening with the Negro president, Gay rights, liberal laws, and of course the Nazi government in the U.S.  I know that one day the Antichrist will emerge and do to Christians what Hitler did to the Jews. It's already happening in some form or another. I know that will make all of you Satanic, sick, filthy, degenerate, Sodomites happy!! Of course until you get thrown into the Lake of Fire. You know, the one You DON'T think is there??? Well tell me this, can you PROVE it's not there?  Take a 50/50 chance maybe you will burn in hell maybe not. You are a fool!!!  By the way twisted the scriptures will do you no good!!!  You are an athiest( which doesn't surprise me since you are a Sodomite) and you are trying to twist the scriptures to justify living in sin!!!! LOL.

The_Countess
The_Countess

 @k.george80 "You mean REAL people?"

 

sorry you are not real. people like you have become a caricature of yourselfs.

 

"You will spend enternity in the Lake of Fire because the Bible SAYS you will! Not ME, not Charlie Sheen, Not Kirk Cameron, BUT THE BIBLE YOU FOOL!"

 

so god in his all knowing all powerful wisdom put me on this planet, born to my mother, KNOWING i would become atheist. he's all knowing after all.

that means he KNOWINGLY set me up to burn in hell.

 

and he put others in bodies he KNEW would be gay. and let other be born KNOWING they would never even hear about Christianity. he SET ALL OF THOSE PEOPLE UP TO BURN IN HELL.

 

now does that sound like the loving god you hold dear?

so even if he does exist he's not worth worshipping.

 

o btw, the gays are abominations is old testament. it no longer holds true, the same way stoning your children to death for being disobedient no longer holds true.

so why do you pick and chose from your own book?

mjdelcas
mjdelcas

 @k.george80  @truthseeker1797 Real biblical reply, there, church guy.  Golden Rule all the way, I'm assuming is the way you live your life. Great use of ALL CAPS, too.  You must be over 60.

 

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